Now that I
have met him, I know why Robert Townsend‘s first movie was about the movies. He
loves movies. He loves going to them, seeing them again, reading about them,
remembering them, trying to make movies like the ones he loves. 

I get letters all
the time from kids who want to be movie directors. They want to know which
school they should go to. UCLA, or USC? NYU maybe? Robert Townsend came
out of a poor black neighborhood on the West Side of Chicago and he didn’t have
to agonize over choices like that. A lot of what he learned about the movies,
he learned while he was sitting in front of a TV set, watching them. Maybe it
was that love that made him into movie director.

I talk to him, and
the great names pour forth: Capra, Hitchcock, Gable, Hepburn, Jimmy
Stewart and Errol Flynn, “The Wizard of Oz” and “The
Godfather.” When he finally broke into films, it was as an extra: “My
mother spent four years going to the movies and looking for the back of my head.”
In 1987 Townsend finally made his own film, “Hollywood Shuffle,” and
the story of its making became a legend. How he borrowed money and stretched
the credit cards of everybody he knew, begged for leftover film stock, talked
people into working for free or on deferral, and made a feature film for
$100,000 that turned into a box office hit.

It was a ragged
film, no masterpiece, but it had spirit. It was a satire on Hollywood
movie genres, starring Townsend as a young black actor trying to make it, and
running up against one stereotype after another. Townsend wrote it with Keenan
Ivory Wayans, who went on to adapt a similar approach to the TV comedy series
“In Living Color.” Townsend spent the next three years acting in
movies like ‘The Mighty Quinn” (where he was Denzel Washington’s friend
and foe, the unflappable Maubee). At the same time he was putting together his
own movie, the story of a singing group named “The Five Heartbeats,”
and it will open around the country on March 29.

There’s a lot of
people who did it for the money, and it shows. I think when [Disney boss] Jeff
Katzenberg wrote that memo that everyone has been talking about, basically he
was saying that films aren’t as magical as they used to be. We’re spending all
this money on explosions and stuff, but why don’t we take some time and look at
the words again?”

He took some time,
and the screenplay that he and Wayans wrote for “The Five Heartbeats”
is a thoughtfully, carefully drawn portrait of a five-man rock singing group
that forms in the 1960s, and goes through hard times and good times and a lot
of changes. The lead singer drops out, a victim of drugs, and the other members
learn by hard experience how to deal with success, romance and life on the road.
There have been a lot of musical biopics, but rarely one as interested in the
singers as in the song.

“Our original
inspiration for the group is sort of a mixture of the Dells, the Temptations,
and the Spinners,” Townsend said. “The Dells, who served as my
technical advisors gave me a lot of stuff that was going on back then with
black singing groups. They told me about their how they weren’t allowed to
appear on their first album cover, so white record buyers wouldn’t know they
were black. That’s where the scene in the movie came from. There’s fiction in
the movie, but also a lot of real stuff they gave me.”

We were talking not
long after Townsend brought his movie home to Chicago for its first public
screenings, which were especially important because his mother was in the
audience–not to mention the high school teacher and the local 12-year-old he
cast in two of the key roles, and various people who knew, or were, the
original inspirations for the characters. I wondered if there was anything particular
about this story that made him want to tell it.

“The material
let me do a lot of different things in one movie,” he said. “There is
comedy, drama, and five totally different personalities trying to be one
singing group. The more time I spent around the Dells, the more fascinated I
was. They’ve been together for 38 years! I don’t know anybody who’s been together
that long. They were friends in high school. It’s like they’re married
together, because you can’t see one without the other. And as an actor in the
movie, I get to sing, dance, and play the piano, so the story gave me a chance
to go in all those directions.”

It’s not simply a
showbiz movie, though, I said. There’s a lot of drama about families in it, and
about how some of the guys grow up faster than the others, and one wanders off
into drugs.

“Yeah. I
wanted it to have more body, to go a little bit deeper. A lot of movies don’t
have real values anymore. They’re disposable, geared toward one weekend. They
just throw a lot of noise and action at you. They don’t care. You look at the
shape of the country, and the crime statistics, and then you look at the
movies, and a lot of them are catering to that climate of violence, helping to
feed it. I just have different values.”

His values were
formed, he said, as he was growing up in Chicago. “You
know, my mother told me I could do anything. We were on welfare for many years,
and still she was telling me this, and I listened. So when people look at me
and say Townsend’s a hyphenate, a writer-director-producer-actor, I really
thank my mother for that. She didn’t think there was anything you couldn’t do.
Success to me is a lot more than just getting out of the limo.

“I grew up on
the west side of Chicago.
I went to Austin High School. I have a lot of friends who
are still there. So, I make it a point to go back to the neighborhood because
sometimes kids will cynically say, ‘Robert Townsend didn’t go here!’ and the
teachers will say, yes he did, and then when I turn up…I think it just does
something. I went back to my high school. I went back to my grammar school. I
talked to the kids, and I say you might not have listened to your teachers, but
take it from me, you need an education.”

For everybody who
directs a Hollywood film, a thousand probably
try and fail. What did you do that was different?

“For me, how
it started was, I studied great movies. I would look at ‘Casablanca,’
I would look at ‘Mr. Smith Goes to Washington,’
and I studied those films until they became my film school. I would look, and
listen to the words, and look at the extras in the background, and read books
on the directors, like Frank Capra.

“I really have
a love and a respect for movies. When I’m behind the camera, l genuinely love
it. When I hear the audience applaud or boo or hiss or whatever, and I’ve got
’em, and I threw a curve in there and they didn’t know it was coming–it makes
me feel good. That’s what all movies should do.

“I think that Hollywood doesn’t value
writers anymore, and I think that’s a big mistake, because back in the old
days, writers nurtured the words. I think it’s sad today. You go to see a
movie, and everyone’s ahead of the story. People yell at the screen, because
they know how it’s going to unfold.” Townsend’s first successes were as an
actor. He started as the youngest member of the Chicago Theater Company, he
went through Second City, he did a lot of standup comedy, and of course he did
all those years as an extra before he put together “Hollywood
Shuffle.” He still remembers his fear on the day he went for his first
audition.

There’s a lot of
people who did it for the money, and it shows. I think when [Disney boss] Jeff
Katzenberg wrote that memo that everyone has been talking about, basically he
was saying that films aren’t as magical as they used to be. We’re spending all
this money on explosions and stuff, but why don’t we take some time and look at
the words again?”

He took some time,
and the screenplay that he and Wayans wrote for “The Five Heartbeats”
is a thoughtfully, carefully drawn portrait of a five-man rock singing group
that forms in the 1960s, and goes through hard times and good times and a lot
of changes. The lead singer drops out, a victim of drugs, and the other members
learn by hard experience how to deal with success, romance and life on the road.
There have been a lot of musical biopics, but rarely one as interested in the
singers as in the song.

“Our original
inspiration for the group is sort of a mixture of the Dells, the Temptations,
and the Spinners,” Townsend said. “The Dells, who served as my
technical advisors gave me a lot of stuff that was going on back then with
black singing groups. They told me about their how they weren’t allowed to
appear on their first album cover, so white record buyers wouldn’t know they
were black. That’s where the scene in the movie came from. There’s fiction in
the movie, but also a lot of real stuff they gave me.”

We were talking not
long after Townsend brought his movie home to Chicago for its first public
screenings, which were especially important because his mother was in the
audience–not to mention the high school teacher and the local 12-year-old he
cast in two of the key roles, and various people who knew, or were, the
original inspirations for the characters. I wondered if there was anything particular
about this story that made him want to tell it.

“The material
let me do a lot of different things in one movie,” he said. “There is
comedy, drama, and five totally different personalities trying to be one
singing group. The more time I spent around the Dells, the more fascinated I
was. They’ve been together for 38 years! I don’t know anybody who’s been together
that long. They were friends in high school. It’s like they’re married
together, because you can’t see one without the other. And as an actor in the
movie, I get to sing, dance, and play the piano, so the story gave me a chance
to go in all those directions.”

It’s not simply a
showbiz movie, though, I said. There’s a lot of drama about families in it, and
about how some of the guys grow up faster than the others, and one wanders off
into drugs.

“Yeah. I
wanted it to have more body, to go a little bit deeper. A lot of movies don’t
have real values anymore. They’re disposable, geared toward one weekend. They
just throw a lot of noise and action at you. They don’t care. You look at the
shape of the country, and the crime statistics, and then you look at the
movies, and a lot of them are catering to that climate of violence, helping to
feed it. I just have different values.”

His values were
formed, he said, as he was growing up in Chicago. “You
know, my mother told me I could do anything. We were on welfare for many years,
and still she was telling me this, and I listened. So when people look at me
and say Townsend’s a hyphenate, a writer-director-producer-actor, I really
thank my mother for that. She didn’t think there was anything you couldn’t do.
Success to me is a lot more than just getting out of the limo.

“I grew up on
the west side of Chicago.
I went to Austin High School. I have a lot of friends who
are still there. So, I make it a point to go back to the neighborhood because
sometimes kids will cynically say, ‘Robert Townsend didn’t go here!’ and the
teachers will say, yes he did, and then when I turn up…I think it just does
something. I went back to my high school. I went back to my grammar school. I
talked to the kids, and I say you might not have listened to your teachers, but
take it from me, you need an education.”

For everybody who
directs a Hollywood film, a thousand probably
try and fail. What did you do that was different?

“For me, how
it started was, I studied great movies. I would look at ‘Casablanca,’
I would look at ‘Mr. Smith Goes to Washington,’
and I studied those films until they became my film school. I would look, and
listen to the words, and look at the extras in the background, and read books
on the directors, like Frank Capra.

“I really have
a love and a respect for movies. When I’m behind the camera, l genuinely love
it. When I hear the audience applaud or boo or hiss or whatever, and I’ve got
’em, and I threw a curve in there and they didn’t know it was coming–it makes
me feel good. That’s what all movies should do.

“I think that Hollywood doesn’t value
writers anymore, and I think that’s a big mistake, because back in the old
days, writers nurtured the words. I think it’s sad today. You go to see a
movie, and everyone’s ahead of the story. People yell at the screen, because
they know how it’s going to unfold.” Townsend’s first successes were as an
actor. He started as the youngest member of the Chicago Theater Company, he
went through Second City, he did a lot of standup comedy, and of course he did
all those years as an extra before he put together “Hollywood
Shuffle.” He still remembers his fear on the day he went for his first
audition.

He took some time,
and the screenplay that he and Wayans wrote for “The Five Heartbeats”
is a thoughtfully, carefully drawn portrait of a five-man rock singing group
that forms in the 1960s, and goes through hard times and good times and a lot
of changes. The lead singer drops out, a victim of drugs, and the other members
learn by hard experience how to deal with success, romance and life on the road.
There have been a lot of musical biopics, but rarely one as interested in the
singers as in the song.

“Our original
inspiration for the group is sort of a mixture of the Dells, the Temptations,
and the Spinners,” Townsend said. “The Dells, who served as my
technical advisors gave me a lot of stuff that was going on back then with
black singing groups. They told me about their how they weren’t allowed to
appear on their first album cover, so white record buyers wouldn’t know they
were black. That’s where the scene in the movie came from. There’s fiction in
the movie, but also a lot of real stuff they gave me.”

We were talking not
long after Townsend brought his movie home to Chicago for its first public
screenings, which were especially important because his mother was in the
audience–not to mention the high school teacher and the local 12-year-old he
cast in two of the key roles, and various people who knew, or were, the
original inspirations for the characters. I wondered if there was anything particular
about this story that made him want to tell it.

“The material
let me do a lot of different things in one movie,” he said. “There is
comedy, drama, and five totally different personalities trying to be one
singing group. The more time I spent around the Dells, the more fascinated I
was. They’ve been together for 38 years! I don’t know anybody who’s been together
that long. They were friends in high school. It’s like they’re married
together, because you can’t see one without the other. And as an actor in the
movie, I get to sing, dance, and play the piano, so the story gave me a chance
to go in all those directions.”

It’s not simply a
showbiz movie, though, I said. There’s a lot of drama about families in it, and
about how some of the guys grow up faster than the others, and one wanders off
into drugs.

“Yeah. I
wanted it to have more body, to go a little bit deeper. A lot of movies don’t
have real values anymore. They’re disposable, geared toward one weekend. They
just throw a lot of noise and action at you. They don’t care. You look at the
shape of the country, and the crime statistics, and then you look at the
movies, and a lot of them are catering to that climate of violence, helping to
feed it. I just have different values.”

His values were
formed, he said, as he was growing up in Chicago. “You
know, my mother told me I could do anything. We were on welfare for many years,
and still she was telling me this, and I listened. So when people look at me
and say Townsend’s a hyphenate, a writer-director-producer-actor, I really
thank my mother for that. She didn’t think there was anything you couldn’t do.
Success to me is a lot more than just getting out of the limo.

“I grew up on
the west side of Chicago.
I went to Austin High School. I have a lot of friends who
are still there. So, I make it a point to go back to the neighborhood because
sometimes kids will cynically say, ‘Robert Townsend didn’t go here!’ and the
teachers will say, yes he did, and then when I turn up…I think it just does
something. I went back to my high school. I went back to my grammar school. I
talked to the kids, and I say you might not have listened to your teachers, but
take it from me, you need an education.”

For everybody who
directs a Hollywood film, a thousand probably
try and fail. What did you do that was different?

“For me, how
it started was, I studied great movies. I would look at ‘Casablanca,’
I would look at ‘Mr. Smith Goes to Washington,’
and I studied those films until they became my film school. I would look, and
listen to the words, and look at the extras in the background, and read books
on the directors, like Frank Capra.

“I really have
a love and a respect for movies. When I’m behind the camera, l genuinely love
it. When I hear the audience applaud or boo or hiss or whatever, and I’ve got
’em, and I threw a curve in there and they didn’t know it was coming–it makes
me feel good. That’s what all movies should do.

“I think that Hollywood doesn’t value
writers anymore, and I think that’s a big mistake, because back in the old
days, writers nurtured the words. I think it’s sad today. You go to see a
movie, and everyone’s ahead of the story. People yell at the screen, because
they know how it’s going to unfold.” Townsend’s first successes were as an
actor. He started as the youngest member of the Chicago Theater Company, he
went through Second City, he did a lot of standup comedy, and of course he did
all those years as an extra before he put together “Hollywood
Shuffle.” He still remembers his fear on the day he went for his first
audition.

“Our original
inspiration for the group is sort of a mixture of the Dells, the Temptations,
and the Spinners,” Townsend said. “The Dells, who served as my
technical advisors gave me a lot of stuff that was going on back then with
black singing groups. They told me about their how they weren’t allowed to
appear on their first album cover, so white record buyers wouldn’t know they
were black. That’s where the scene in the movie came from. There’s fiction in
the movie, but also a lot of real stuff they gave me.”

We were talking not
long after Townsend brought his movie home to Chicago for its first public
screenings, which were especially important because his mother was in the
audience–not to mention the high school teacher and the local 12-year-old he
cast in two of the key roles, and various people who knew, or were, the
original inspirations for the characters. I wondered if there was anything particular
about this story that made him want to tell it.

“The material
let me do a lot of different things in one movie,” he said. “There is
comedy, drama, and five totally different personalities trying to be one
singing group. The more time I spent around the Dells, the more fascinated I
was. They’ve been together for 38 years! I don’t know anybody who’s been together
that long. They were friends in high school. It’s like they’re married
together, because you can’t see one without the other. And as an actor in the
movie, I get to sing, dance, and play the piano, so the story gave me a chance
to go in all those directions.”

It’s not simply a
showbiz movie, though, I said. There’s a lot of drama about families in it, and
about how some of the guys grow up faster than the others, and one wanders off
into drugs.

“Yeah. I
wanted it to have more body, to go a little bit deeper. A lot of movies don’t
have real values anymore. They’re disposable, geared toward one weekend. They
just throw a lot of noise and action at you. They don’t care. You look at the
shape of the country, and the crime statistics, and then you look at the
movies, and a lot of them are catering to that climate of violence, helping to
feed it. I just have different values.”

His values were
formed, he said, as he was growing up in Chicago. “You
know, my mother told me I could do anything. We were on welfare for many years,
and still she was telling me this, and I listened. So when people look at me
and say Townsend’s a hyphenate, a writer-director-producer-actor, I really
thank my mother for that. She didn’t think there was anything you couldn’t do.
Success to me is a lot more than just getting out of the limo.

“I grew up on
the west side of Chicago.
I went to Austin High School. I have a lot of friends who
are still there. So, I make it a point to go back to the neighborhood because
sometimes kids will cynically say, ‘Robert Townsend didn’t go here!’ and the
teachers will say, yes he did, and then when I turn up…I think it just does
something. I went back to my high school. I went back to my grammar school. I
talked to the kids, and I say you might not have listened to your teachers, but
take it from me, you need an education.”

For everybody who
directs a Hollywood film, a thousand probably
try and fail. What did you do that was different?

“For me, how
it started was, I studied great movies. I would look at ‘Casablanca,’
I would look at ‘Mr. Smith Goes to Washington,’
and I studied those films until they became my film school. I would look, and
listen to the words, and look at the extras in the background, and read books
on the directors, like Frank Capra.

“I really have
a love and a respect for movies. When I’m behind the camera, l genuinely love
it. When I hear the audience applaud or boo or hiss or whatever, and I’ve got
’em, and I threw a curve in there and they didn’t know it was coming–it makes
me feel good. That’s what all movies should do.

“I think that Hollywood doesn’t value
writers anymore, and I think that’s a big mistake, because back in the old
days, writers nurtured the words. I think it’s sad today. You go to see a
movie, and everyone’s ahead of the story. People yell at the screen, because
they know how it’s going to unfold.” Townsend’s first successes were as an
actor. He started as the youngest member of the Chicago Theater Company, he
went through Second City, he did a lot of standup comedy, and of course he did
all those years as an extra before he put together “Hollywood
Shuffle.” He still remembers his fear on the day he went for his first
audition.

We were talking not
long after Townsend brought his movie home to Chicago for its first public
screenings, which were especially important because his mother was in the
audience–not to mention the high school teacher and the local 12-year-old he
cast in two of the key roles, and various people who knew, or were, the
original inspirations for the characters. I wondered if there was anything particular
about this story that made him want to tell it.

“The material
let me do a lot of different things in one movie,” he said. “There is
comedy, drama, and five totally different personalities trying to be one
singing group. The more time I spent around the Dells, the more fascinated I
was. They’ve been together for 38 years! I don’t know anybody who’s been together
that long. They were friends in high school. It’s like they’re married
together, because you can’t see one without the other. And as an actor in the
movie, I get to sing, dance, and play the piano, so the story gave me a chance
to go in all those directions.”

It’s not simply a
showbiz movie, though, I said. There’s a lot of drama about families in it, and
about how some of the guys grow up faster than the others, and one wanders off
into drugs.

“Yeah. I
wanted it to have more body, to go a little bit deeper. A lot of movies don’t
have real values anymore. They’re disposable, geared toward one weekend. They
just throw a lot of noise and action at you. They don’t care. You look at the
shape of the country, and the crime statistics, and then you look at the
movies, and a lot of them are catering to that climate of violence, helping to
feed it. I just have different values.”

His values were
formed, he said, as he was growing up in Chicago. “You
know, my mother told me I could do anything. We were on welfare for many years,
and still she was telling me this, and I listened. So when people look at me
and say Townsend’s a hyphenate, a writer-director-producer-actor, I really
thank my mother for that. She didn’t think there was anything you couldn’t do.
Success to me is a lot more than just getting out of the limo.

“I grew up on
the west side of Chicago.
I went to Austin High School. I have a lot of friends who
are still there. So, I make it a point to go back to the neighborhood because
sometimes kids will cynically say, ‘Robert Townsend didn’t go here!’ and the
teachers will say, yes he did, and then when I turn up…I think it just does
something. I went back to my high school. I went back to my grammar school. I
talked to the kids, and I say you might not have listened to your teachers, but
take it from me, you need an education.”

For everybody who
directs a Hollywood film, a thousand probably
try and fail. What did you do that was different?

“For me, how
it started was, I studied great movies. I would look at ‘Casablanca,’
I would look at ‘Mr. Smith Goes to Washington,’
and I studied those films until they became my film school. I would look, and
listen to the words, and look at the extras in the background, and read books
on the directors, like Frank Capra.

“I really have
a love and a respect for movies. When I’m behind the camera, l genuinely love
it. When I hear the audience applaud or boo or hiss or whatever, and I’ve got
’em, and I threw a curve in there and they didn’t know it was coming–it makes
me feel good. That’s what all movies should do.

“I think that Hollywood doesn’t value
writers anymore, and I think that’s a big mistake, because back in the old
days, writers nurtured the words. I think it’s sad today. You go to see a
movie, and everyone’s ahead of the story. People yell at the screen, because
they know how it’s going to unfold.” Townsend’s first successes were as an
actor. He started as the youngest member of the Chicago Theater Company, he
went through Second City, he did a lot of standup comedy, and of course he did
all those years as an extra before he put together “Hollywood
Shuffle.” He still remembers his fear on the day he went for his first
audition.

“The material
let me do a lot of different things in one movie,” he said. “There is
comedy, drama, and five totally different personalities trying to be one
singing group. The more time I spent around the Dells, the more fascinated I
was. They’ve been together for 38 years! I don’t know anybody who’s been together
that long. They were friends in high school. It’s like they’re married
together, because you can’t see one without the other. And as an actor in the
movie, I get to sing, dance, and play the piano, so the story gave me a chance
to go in all those directions.”

It’s not simply a
showbiz movie, though, I said. There’s a lot of drama about families in it, and
about how some of the guys grow up faster than the others, and one wanders off
into drugs.

“Yeah. I
wanted it to have more body, to go a little bit deeper. A lot of movies don’t
have real values anymore. They’re disposable, geared toward one weekend. They
just throw a lot of noise and action at you. They don’t care. You look at the
shape of the country, and the crime statistics, and then you look at the
movies, and a lot of them are catering to that climate of violence, helping to
feed it. I just have different values.”

His values were
formed, he said, as he was growing up in Chicago. “You
know, my mother told me I could do anything. We were on welfare for many years,
and still she was telling me this, and I listened. So when people look at me
and say Townsend’s a hyphenate, a writer-director-producer-actor, I really
thank my mother for that. She didn’t think there was anything you couldn’t do.
Success to me is a lot more than just getting out of the limo.

“I grew up on
the west side of Chicago.
I went to Austin High School. I have a lot of friends who
are still there. So, I make it a point to go back to the neighborhood because
sometimes kids will cynically say, ‘Robert Townsend didn’t go here!’ and the
teachers will say, yes he did, and then when I turn up…I think it just does
something. I went back to my high school. I went back to my grammar school. I
talked to the kids, and I say you might not have listened to your teachers, but
take it from me, you need an education.”

For everybody who
directs a Hollywood film, a thousand probably
try and fail. What did you do that was different?

“For me, how
it started was, I studied great movies. I would look at ‘Casablanca,’
I would look at ‘Mr. Smith Goes to Washington,’
and I studied those films until they became my film school. I would look, and
listen to the words, and look at the extras in the background, and read books
on the directors, like Frank Capra.

“I really have
a love and a respect for movies. When I’m behind the camera, l genuinely love
it. When I hear the audience applaud or boo or hiss or whatever, and I’ve got
’em, and I threw a curve in there and they didn’t know it was coming–it makes
me feel good. That’s what all movies should do.

“I think that Hollywood doesn’t value
writers anymore, and I think that’s a big mistake, because back in the old
days, writers nurtured the words. I think it’s sad today. You go to see a
movie, and everyone’s ahead of the story. People yell at the screen, because
they know how it’s going to unfold.” Townsend’s first successes were as an
actor. He started as the youngest member of the Chicago Theater Company, he
went through Second City, he did a lot of standup comedy, and of course he did
all those years as an extra before he put together “Hollywood
Shuffle.” He still remembers his fear on the day he went for his first
audition.

It’s not simply a
showbiz movie, though, I said. There’s a lot of drama about families in it, and
about how some of the guys grow up faster than the others, and one wanders off
into drugs.

“Yeah. I
wanted it to have more body, to go a little bit deeper. A lot of movies don’t
have real values anymore. They’re disposable, geared toward one weekend. They
just throw a lot of noise and action at you. They don’t care. You look at the
shape of the country, and the crime statistics, and then you look at the
movies, and a lot of them are catering to that climate of violence, helping to
feed it. I just have different values.”

His values were
formed, he said, as he was growing up in Chicago. “You
know, my mother told me I could do anything. We were on welfare for many years,
and still she was telling me this, and I listened. So when people look at me
and say Townsend’s a hyphenate, a writer-director-producer-actor, I really
thank my mother for that. She didn’t think there was anything you couldn’t do.
Success to me is a lot more than just getting out of the limo.

“I grew up on
the west side of Chicago.
I went to Austin High School. I have a lot of friends who
are still there. So, I make it a point to go back to the neighborhood because
sometimes kids will cynically say, ‘Robert Townsend didn’t go here!’ and the
teachers will say, yes he did, and then when I turn up…I think it just does
something. I went back to my high school. I went back to my grammar school. I
talked to the kids, and I say you might not have listened to your teachers, but
take it from me, you need an education.”

For everybody who
directs a Hollywood film, a thousand probably
try and fail. What did you do that was different?

“For me, how
it started was, I studied great movies. I would look at ‘Casablanca,’
I would look at ‘Mr. Smith Goes to Washington,’
and I studied those films until they became my film school. I would look, and
listen to the words, and look at the extras in the background, and read books
on the directors, like Frank Capra.

“I really have
a love and a respect for movies. When I’m behind the camera, l genuinely love
it. When I hear the audience applaud or boo or hiss or whatever, and I’ve got
’em, and I threw a curve in there and they didn’t know it was coming–it makes
me feel good. That’s what all movies should do.

“I think that Hollywood doesn’t value
writers anymore, and I think that’s a big mistake, because back in the old
days, writers nurtured the words. I think it’s sad today. You go to see a
movie, and everyone’s ahead of the story. People yell at the screen, because
they know how it’s going to unfold.” Townsend’s first successes were as an
actor. He started as the youngest member of the Chicago Theater Company, he
went through Second City, he did a lot of standup comedy, and of course he did
all those years as an extra before he put together “Hollywood
Shuffle.” He still remembers his fear on the day he went for his first
audition.

“Yeah. I
wanted it to have more body, to go a little bit deeper. A lot of movies don’t
have real values anymore. They’re disposable, geared toward one weekend. They
just throw a lot of noise and action at you. They don’t care. You look at the
shape of the country, and the crime statistics, and then you look at the
movies, and a lot of them are catering to that climate of violence, helping to
feed it. I just have different values.”

His values were
formed, he said, as he was growing up in Chicago. “You
know, my mother told me I could do anything. We were on welfare for many years,
and still she was telling me this, and I listened. So when people look at me
and say Townsend’s a hyphenate, a writer-director-producer-actor, I really
thank my mother for that. She didn’t think there was anything you couldn’t do.
Success to me is a lot more than just getting out of the limo.

“I grew up on
the west side of Chicago.
I went to Austin High School. I have a lot of friends who
are still there. So, I make it a point to go back to the neighborhood because
sometimes kids will cynically say, ‘Robert Townsend didn’t go here!’ and the
teachers will say, yes he did, and then when I turn up…I think it just does
something. I went back to my high school. I went back to my grammar school. I
talked to the kids, and I say you might not have listened to your teachers, but
take it from me, you need an education.”

For everybody who
directs a Hollywood film, a thousand probably
try and fail. What did you do that was different?

“For me, how
it started was, I studied great movies. I would look at ‘Casablanca,’
I would look at ‘Mr. Smith Goes to Washington,’
and I studied those films until they became my film school. I would look, and
listen to the words, and look at the extras in the background, and read books
on the directors, like Frank Capra.

“I really have
a love and a respect for movies. When I’m behind the camera, l genuinely love
it. When I hear the audience applaud or boo or hiss or whatever, and I’ve got
’em, and I threw a curve in there and they didn’t know it was coming–it makes
me feel good. That’s what all movies should do.

“I think that Hollywood doesn’t value
writers anymore, and I think that’s a big mistake, because back in the old
days, writers nurtured the words. I think it’s sad today. You go to see a
movie, and everyone’s ahead of the story. People yell at the screen, because
they know how it’s going to unfold.” Townsend’s first successes were as an
actor. He started as the youngest member of the Chicago Theater Company, he
went through Second City, he did a lot of standup comedy, and of course he did
all those years as an extra before he put together “Hollywood
Shuffle.” He still remembers his fear on the day he went for his first
audition.

His values were
formed, he said, as he was growing up in Chicago. “You
know, my mother told me I could do anything. We were on welfare for many years,
and still she was telling me this, and I listened. So when people look at me
and say Townsend’s a hyphenate, a writer-director-producer-actor, I really
thank my mother for that. She didn’t think there was anything you couldn’t do.
Success to me is a lot more than just getting out of the limo.

“I grew up on
the west side of Chicago.
I went to Austin High School. I have a lot of friends who
are still there. So, I make it a point to go back to the neighborhood because
sometimes kids will cynically say, ‘Robert Townsend didn’t go here!’ and the
teachers will say, yes he did, and then when I turn up…I think it just does
something. I went back to my high school. I went back to my grammar school. I
talked to the kids, and I say you might not have listened to your teachers, but
take it from me, you need an education.”

For everybody who
directs a Hollywood film, a thousand probably
try and fail. What did you do that was different?

“For me, how
it started was, I studied great movies. I would look at ‘Casablanca,’
I would look at ‘Mr. Smith Goes to Washington,’
and I studied those films until they became my film school. I would look, and
listen to the words, and look at the extras in the background, and read books
on the directors, like Frank Capra.

“I really have
a love and a respect for movies. When I’m behind the camera, l genuinely love
it. When I hear the audience applaud or boo or hiss or whatever, and I’ve got
’em, and I threw a curve in there and they didn’t know it was coming–it makes
me feel good. That’s what all movies should do.

“I think that Hollywood doesn’t value
writers anymore, and I think that’s a big mistake, because back in the old
days, writers nurtured the words. I think it’s sad today. You go to see a
movie, and everyone’s ahead of the story. People yell at the screen, because
they know how it’s going to unfold.” Townsend’s first successes were as an
actor. He started as the youngest member of the Chicago Theater Company, he
went through Second City, he did a lot of standup comedy, and of course he did
all those years as an extra before he put together “Hollywood
Shuffle.” He still remembers his fear on the day he went for his first
audition.

“I grew up on
the west side of Chicago.
I went to Austin High School. I have a lot of friends who
are still there. So, I make it a point to go back to the neighborhood because
sometimes kids will cynically say, ‘Robert Townsend didn’t go here!’ and the
teachers will say, yes he did, and then when I turn up…I think it just does
something. I went back to my high school. I went back to my grammar school. I
talked to the kids, and I say you might not have listened to your teachers, but
take it from me, you need an education.”

For everybody who
directs a Hollywood film, a thousand probably
try and fail. What did you do that was different?

“For me, how
it started was, I studied great movies. I would look at ‘Casablanca,’
I would look at ‘Mr. Smith Goes to Washington,’
and I studied those films until they became my film school. I would look, and
listen to the words, and look at the extras in the background, and read books
on the directors, like Frank Capra.

“I really have
a love and a respect for movies. When I’m behind the camera, l genuinely love
it. When I hear the audience applaud or boo or hiss or whatever, and I’ve got
’em, and I threw a curve in there and they didn’t know it was coming–it makes
me feel good. That’s what all movies should do.

“I think that Hollywood doesn’t value
writers anymore, and I think that’s a big mistake, because back in the old
days, writers nurtured the words. I think it’s sad today. You go to see a
movie, and everyone’s ahead of the story. People yell at the screen, because
they know how it’s going to unfold.” Townsend’s first successes were as an
actor. He started as the youngest member of the Chicago Theater Company, he
went through Second City, he did a lot of standup comedy, and of course he did
all those years as an extra before he put together “Hollywood
Shuffle.” He still remembers his fear on the day he went for his first
audition.

For everybody who
directs a Hollywood film, a thousand probably
try and fail. What did you do that was different?

“For me, how
it started was, I studied great movies. I would look at ‘Casablanca,’
I would look at ‘Mr. Smith Goes to Washington,’
and I studied those films until they became my film school. I would look, and
listen to the words, and look at the extras in the background, and read books
on the directors, like Frank Capra.

“I really have
a love and a respect for movies. When I’m behind the camera, l genuinely love
it. When I hear the audience applaud or boo or hiss or whatever, and I’ve got
’em, and I threw a curve in there and they didn’t know it was coming–it makes
me feel good. That’s what all movies should do.

“I think that Hollywood doesn’t value
writers anymore, and I think that’s a big mistake, because back in the old
days, writers nurtured the words. I think it’s sad today. You go to see a
movie, and everyone’s ahead of the story. People yell at the screen, because
they know how it’s going to unfold.” Townsend’s first successes were as an
actor. He started as the youngest member of the Chicago Theater Company, he
went through Second City, he did a lot of standup comedy, and of course he did
all those years as an extra before he put together “Hollywood
Shuffle.” He still remembers his fear on the day he went for his first
audition.

“For me, how
it started was, I studied great movies. I would look at ‘Casablanca,’
I would look at ‘Mr. Smith Goes to Washington,’
and I studied those films until they became my film school. I would look, and
listen to the words, and look at the extras in the background, and read books
on the directors, like Frank Capra.

“I really have
a love and a respect for movies. When I’m behind the camera, l genuinely love
it. When I hear the audience applaud or boo or hiss or whatever, and I’ve got
’em, and I threw a curve in there and they didn’t know it was coming–it makes
me feel good. That’s what all movies should do.

“I think that Hollywood doesn’t value
writers anymore, and I think that’s a big mistake, because back in the old
days, writers nurtured the words. I think it’s sad today. You go to see a
movie, and everyone’s ahead of the story. People yell at the screen, because
they know how it’s going to unfold.” Townsend’s first successes were as an
actor. He started as the youngest member of the Chicago Theater Company, he
went through Second City, he did a lot of standup comedy, and of course he did
all those years as an extra before he put together “Hollywood
Shuffle.” He still remembers his fear on the day he went for his first
audition.

“I really have
a love and a respect for movies. When I’m behind the camera, l genuinely love
it. When I hear the audience applaud or boo or hiss or whatever, and I’ve got
’em, and I threw a curve in there and they didn’t know it was coming–it makes
me feel good. That’s what all movies should do.

“I think that Hollywood doesn’t value
writers anymore, and I think that’s a big mistake, because back in the old
days, writers nurtured the words. I think it’s sad today. You go to see a
movie, and everyone’s ahead of the story. People yell at the screen, because
they know how it’s going to unfold.” Townsend’s first successes were as an
actor. He started as the youngest member of the Chicago Theater Company, he
went through Second City, he did a lot of standup comedy, and of course he did
all those years as an extra before he put together “Hollywood
Shuffle.” He still remembers his fear on the day he went for his first
audition.

“I think that Hollywood doesn’t value
writers anymore, and I think that’s a big mistake, because back in the old
days, writers nurtured the words. I think it’s sad today. You go to see a
movie, and everyone’s ahead of the story. People yell at the screen, because
they know how it’s going to unfold.” Townsend’s first successes were as an
actor. He started as the youngest member of the Chicago Theater Company, he
went through Second City, he did a lot of standup comedy, and of course he did
all those years as an extra before he put together “Hollywood
Shuffle.” He still remembers his fear on the day he went for his first
audition.

He did the characters for me, falling effortlessly into accents and body
language. “I can be an old man. It could be in Paris. It could be in Africa.
It could be at Bill Cosby’s house.”

He did all the voices: The old man, the Parisian, the African, Cosby.”By
the time it was over, the guy was like, ‘You can do things!’
He gave a part in a play, and that’s how it all started.”

He did the characters for me, falling effortlessly into accents and body
language. “I can be an old man. It could be in Paris. It could be in Africa.
It could be at Bill Cosby’s house.”

He did all the voices: The old man, the Parisian, the African, Cosby.”By
the time it was over, the guy was like, ‘You can do things!’
He gave a part in a play, and that’s how it all started.”

He did all the voices: The old man, the Parisian, the African, Cosby.”By
the time it was over, the guy was like, ‘You can do things!’
He gave a part in a play, and that’s how it all started.”

This time around, Townsend said, he knows a little more about opening a film
than he did after “Hollywood Shuffle.” He’s been in the business for
awhile.

This time around, Townsend said, he knows a little more about opening a film
than he did after “Hollywood Shuffle.” He’s been in the business for
awhile.

“I had always dreamed of being on Johnny Carson, right? But I never
thought that the first time I was on Johnny Carson it would be to promote a
film I had practically done in my bedroom. You always daydream about being in a
$20 million epic, and there I was in a film that I’d made for $100,000, sitting
there talking to Johnny Carson about it. It was weird. I was sitting there
watching the clip, and the only thing that was on my mind, was–those are my
sheets!”

“I had always dreamed of being on Johnny Carson, right? But I never
thought that the first time I was on Johnny Carson it would be to promote a
film I had practically done in my bedroom. You always daydream about being in a
$20 million epic, and there I was in a film that I’d made for $100,000, sitting
there talking to Johnny Carson about it. It was weird. I was sitting there
watching the clip, and the only thing that was on my mind, was–those are my
sheets!”

The movie means a
lot to Townsend. People have asked him, he said, why he waited so long to make
a second film, since after “Hollywood Shuffle” there were a lot of
offers. “There were 247 movies that came out of Hollywood last year,” he said, “and
if there were 20 that people really felt genuine about, I’d be surprised. 

“I-I was 16. I just loved performing, but when I walked
into the room, I was nervous, shaking, the whole thing. They wanted me to do an
‘improv.’ I hardly knew what that meant. I was so nervous, the guy said `Thank
you,’ to dismiss me, and I said, wait a minute, I can do things! And the guy
said, ‘What do you mean?’ And I started doing these characters.”

Were
you like a lot of kids? Did you stage little plays at home for your family? Did
you get in front of the TV, and interact with the shows?

“What
I would do is–well, we had a little house, my mother raised four kids on her
own, so I would go in the bathroom and close the door, and that became my room.
I would go in front of the mirror, and be Errol Flynn, Clark Gable, I would be
all the characters from the movies, and my mother would hear all these weird,
strange noises through the door. The Alfred Hitchcock program would be on,
and I would be Hitchcock–
 Good even-ning! And my mother would
tell me to work on it. When I was fourteen I could do over 40 voices. I mean,
I’d spend a whole day talking with a British accent, like I was in the
Beatles.” He smiled. “I never said I want to be a director. I
was going to act. But when I was working as an extra, I’d get as close as I
could to the camera, and then as they began to set up shots, I just sat there
and watched, until they told me to stand over there with your back to the wall,
or whatever, and I began to get it.”

Maybe it was the memory of how he got started that led Townsend
to give two local actors big breaks in “The Five Heartbeats.” One of
them is a high school drama teacher named Harry J. Lenox, who plays Dresser,
the slickest member of the group.

“Harry is a Chicago
actor who came in to meet with me,” Townsend said. “I wasn’t having
anybody read the script, I just wanted to meet people to feel if they were
right. And he talked about being a school teacher, and I knew right away, I
want this person for that part. I liked him. He’s a great man, and I think if
you’re great inside yourself, you can be a great actor. I’d never seen any film
on him. I didn’t see him in a play or anything. We talked about teaching. We
talked about his kids, and how he works with them, and I said, ‘That’s
Dresser!'”

And what about the young girl with the powerhouse voice who
plays your kid sister?

He
laughed. “Tressa Thomas. I saw over 7,000 actors for “The Five
Heartbeats.” I went to Chicago, New York, and L.A. and I
had open calls, and she was number 550 in Chicago.
She comes in, she has this little voice, and she starts to sing, and her voice
isn’t little anymore. Her singing was so incredible that at that point, I wrote
this scene where I’m having a hard time trying to write a song, and she takes
my torn-up scraps out of the wastepaper, and shows me how to write it and sing
it.”

“But initially it was like breaking ground. When I went to
the first premiere of my first film, I was in as much awe as anybody else. That
whole period was like a dream.

Roger Ebert

Roger Ebert was the film critic of the Chicago Sun-Times from 1967 until his death in 2013. In 1975, he won the Pulitzer Prize for distinguished criticism.

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